So I Was Wrong Again -- American Politics and No Way Out
About 30 years ago there was a Kevin Costner movie called "No Way Out". If you never saw it and ever intend to, there is a major spoiler coming. Anyway, Costner is a military officer having a fling with a woman played by Sean Young, who is also having a fling with Costner's superior officer. Sean Young turns up dead (probably a fantasy for the director since every director who worked with her wanted to kill her). There is some sense that Costner's superior officer may be guilty, and Costner is named by the officer to lead the investigation, but with a twist -- the officer is trying to get the girl's death blamed on a mysterious Russian spy, who may or may not even be real, to divert attention from his adultery and possibly from the fact that he was probably the killer. Things evolve, and it appears that Costner is going to be framed not only for the girl's death but also as the probably mythical spy. The movie is about Costner desperately trying to escape this frame, and in the end is successful. But in the final scene, Costner is seen speaking in Russian to his controller. He is the spy! The original accusation was totally without evidence, almost random, meant to divert attention from his superior's likely crimes, but by accident they turned out to be correct.
I feel like that with the Russian election hacking story. For months I have said the Russian election hacking story was a nothing. It made little sense and there was pretty much zero evidence. It was dreamed up within 24 hours of the election by a Clinton campaign trying to divert attention and blame for their stunning loss. I have called it many times the Obama birth certificate story of this election.
But it turns out that pursuing any Trump connection whatsoever with Russia has turned up some pretty grubby stories. In particular, seeing a Presidential campaign -- and the President's son -- fawning over unfriendly foreign governments to get their hands on oppo research is just plain ugly. That the Clinton campaign may have done shady things to get oppo research of their own is irrelevant to the ethics here (and perhaps one good justification for electing Republicans, since the media seems to be more aggressive at holding Republicans to account for such things).
Sorry. I fell victim to one of the classic blunders - the most famous of which is "never get involved in a land war in Asia" - but only slightly less well-known is this: "Never underestimate the stupidity and ethical flexibility of politicians."
Postscript: In general, my enforced absence from both twitter and highly partisan blogs is going quite well. I will write more about it soon, but I have to mention this: I had a small break in my isolation yesterday when I was scanning around the radio on a business trip. I landed on Rush Limbaugh, and would have moved on immediately but the first words I heard out of his mouth were "golden showers". OK, I was intrigued. He then used that term about 3 more times in the next 60 seconds (apparently he was going with the "everybody does it" defense of Trump by accusing the Clintons of getting oppo research from the Ukraine, or whatever). Anyway, any issue that has a Conservative talk show host discussing golden showers from Russian hookers can't be all bad.
The case that what Trump Jr. did was unethical, even assuming he had gotten real dirt on Hillary, is exceedingly weak.
Quite frankly, it smells like a set up. The Russian lawyer's (and no, she did not work for or represent the Russian government) visa applications to come to the US were denied several times. Then all of a sudden, the Obama State department let's her in to meet with Trump campaign people?
wreckinball: So you're saying exposing that Hillary and the DNC colluded against
Bernie and rigged the primaries and basically colluded with the entire
media for debate questions, talking points etc. is a bad thing?
That the leadership of the DNC preferred Clinton was not a secret. The DNC is a private organization, and nothing uncovered indicates any illegal activity. However, your belief that Americans should just ignore the fact that Russia is unleashing armies of trolls and hackers against democratic countries, indeed, they should "be rewarded" is a dire threat to democracy and national sovereignty.
Everyone has their own expert. This Election Law Blog post by Professor Rick Hasen says Junior broke several laws
I donated $5 twice to the Obama campaign via credit card in 2012. On one, I filled out the donor name as JV Stalin, Room 200, the Kremlin, Moscow, profession, general secretary of the CPSU. The other one, I put down name as Karl Marx, 9th Circle of Hell, Satan's Domain. both charges went through.
You are full of Bravo Sierra, comrade. how about you ESADMF?
1, They can determine the issuing bank from the card number. They would at least know it was a US issued card.
2. Stalin and Marx are both dead.
3. Even if you had used Putin instead, how likely do you think it is that Putin would have a US issued credit card.
Let's wait for more information before we judge Junior on this. He was a private citizen working on a campaign at the time, it was a false lead anyway, and he has not ever applied for security status so whatever happened is not all that different from what happens in every campaign. It was naive and stupid to think that meeting with someone from the Russian government for campaign information would be helpful or even a good idea but so far as I can discern from reasonable analysis, it is nowhere near as treasonous as Hillary's private server with its lack of security and then her destruction of emails that had been requested by intelligence agencies.
I respect your writing and your intelligence, but this is so wrong I'm stunned. bye.
Trolls?
Sorry free speech
Seriously?
There is nothing to do about that
Hacking, yes bad and the defense is cyber security
Same as before the election
You know who has the rep of being the best hackers and the biggest meddlers?
The US government
I am a but surprised that the same crowd that has no problem justifying all sorts of outrageous judical behavior with "it's the law" and "they shouldn't have broken it if they don't like the consequences" have no trouble justifying their chosen King with an easy "aw shucks, I don't see the concern" when his team is caught with multiple incidents of breaking well established laws...
wreckinball: There is nothing to do about that
If there was collusion with a U.S. political campaign, then it would represent an illegal foreign contribution. Even without collusion, it can be considered a violation of sovereignty.
wreckinball: Hacking, yes bad and the defense is cyber security
Sure, but a country and its allies shouldn't stand idly by while being hacked by a hostile country intent on meddling in democratic elections. It's an act of aggression.
It illegal for US citizens to talk to Russian citizens now? Or is it illegal for Russians to lobby in America?
Well I will say that if we had the election law the progressives wanted, conservative Americans wouldn't get to tell you who they're voting for without breaking the law...
The 80s called and wants their foreign policy back. Oh wait, sorry, wrong narrative. Russia is now totes dangerous.
I would be so effing pissed if the progressives' narratives weren't such obvious total bullshit...
I eagerly await the charges from Israel looking to arrest Obama for interfering in their elections. Oh wait that's different because Obama was the anointed one....
If you weren't such a pathetically obvious progressive sellout, I might give a shit about what you're saying. But basically you're all in on the political party double standards..... so fuck off.
I bet the FISA warrant request follows quickly after the meeting...
Yeah but this last election the Dems did everything they could to pick Trump for the republicans, thinking they'd get an easy win.
It warms my heart they got screwed over by messing with the republican primary process.
From your response, I can't figure out which side you are on. But this blog is well written and honestly presented. You should give it another chance.
I am absolutely certain the left will move to impeach both Trump and Pence simultaneously. All it would require for them to do so would be that they have no honor and they've proved that in spades.
Yeah, but the Dems and MSM colluded, heh would you look at that word,to ensure Trump got the Republican nomination thinking he'd be easy to beat.
But they failed to take into account deplorables like me who in the end voted for Trump instead of the evil bitch Hillary...
The_Big_W: I eagerly await the charges from Israel looking to arrest Obama for interfering in their elections.
The U.S. has often interfered in the internal affairs of other countries; however, the case with Israel is an exaggeration. The U.S. funded legal efforts towards a two-state solution. Some of the infrastructure was re-purposed after the fact. The situation was investigated and new policies put in place to prevent a recurrence.
Ok, got it. Lefty actions, no big deal!!! On the right, literally treason!
Thanks for clearing that up....
Which then means Ryan? I mean this is not going to happen.
It is kind of humorous. I mean the twisting these folks do and the double, triple standards.
Speech is free, even trolls. There is nothing you could or should do about it.
Hacking really is only defendable by cyber security. I mean its obviously successful. Otherwise we'd all be broke by now due to financial system hacks.
And I don't want the internet all tied up in regulatory duct tape because somehow its for our own good.
The internet is the one media that is fueling growth. Leave it alone.
Actually after 2018 it might mean Pelosi. Which the dems would be salivating over....
wreckinball: Hacking really is only defendable by cyber security.
Or by addressing the perpetrators.
wreckinball: I mean its obviously successful.
A nationally coordinated attack on information security is quite different in kind from ordinary criminality.
I would bet that the FISA warrant predates not only the meeting, but the arrangements for the meeting. The Russian Lawyer Trump Jr. meet with is not an agent of the Russian government. Her visa applications to come to the US, were repeatedly denied. Then they were suddenly approved, but no one seems to know why or by whom, and she was in the US before the meeting with Trump Jr was arranged.
Perhaps. Your scenario makes sense. Get the warrant first, set up the meeting to get the "damning" evidence.
It's always amazing to me that the media gets palpitations about Trumps people talking to Russians, but in Every case there is reason to believe that the media has not just the informs that the meetings took place, but the actual content of the meeting itself. Yet they never, ever talk about the content. Could that be because there's Never anything nefarious in any of the discussions....
All I know is that this shit has made me Despise the democrat party. I will Never quietly accept their rule over me again. They want to shit all over the rule of law and accepting the will of the people, fine. No rule of law it is then.....